Electromagnetic Field Resonance

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Apoc posted this 18 June 2024

Seems I come back to this every now and then, in my head it seems like it should work, but physically designing it and building it eludes me.

So I had another very through chat with chatgpt4. I'm convinced that no magnetic field is actually static, which is like blasphemy in the scientific field when it comes to permanent magnets.

If we look at how the atoms in iron can align their electrons together to create a magnetic field. Then take into account that all these electrons are moving (albeit small distances within the individual atoms). Then shouldn't the magnetic field that these electrons are producing move also at the same rate they are moving around the atoms.

The short answer I got from chat gpt is they would be moving in Terra hertz frequencies. Meaning that a permanent magnet made from iron actually has a magnetic field that is essentially vibrating at this same frequency due to the magnetic field being attached to these moving electrons within the atoms of the iron.

I looked it up and Electrons "orbit" Iron atoms at approximately 57,000,000 m/s.

Then if we go back to basics of induction, the speed at which a magnetic field moves (and this is moving wicked fast even if only microscopic distances) then the speed of this movement alone should generate something if the inductor is properly tuned to the rate at which the electrons are orbiting the atoms of the iron magnet. In speculation it seems this should create a very high frequency AC current in the inductor if it is properly tuned to the rate of orbit of the electrons in the iron.

I can picture it all in my head, but where I'm struggling with figuring this out is my lack of knowledge when it comes to electrical power itself and things like inductance and how to build a coil that's supposed to resonate at a specific frequency.


What I picture is a coil wrapped around an iron magnetized core that is in tune with the frequency at which the literal electrons are orbiting the iron atoms.

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Apoc posted this 18 June 2024

Seems I come back to this every now and then, in my head it seems like it should work, but physically designing it and building it eludes me.

So I had another very through chat with chatgpt4. I'm convinced that no magnetic field is actually static, which is like blasphemy in the scientific field when it comes to permanent magnets.

If we look at how the atoms in iron can align their electrons together to create a magnetic field. Then take into account that all these electrons are moving (albeit small distances within the individual atoms). Then shouldn't the magnetic field that these electrons are producing move also at the same rate they are moving around the atoms.

The short answer I got from chat gpt is they would be moving in Terra hertz frequencies. Meaning that a permanent magnet made from iron actually has a magnetic field that is essentially vibrating at this same frequency due to the magnetic field being attached to these moving electrons within the atoms of the iron.

I looked it up and Electrons "orbit" Iron atoms at approximately 57,000,000 m/s.

Then if we go back to basics of induction, the speed at which a magnetic field moves (and this is moving wicked fast even if only microscopic distances) then the speed of this movement alone should generate something if the inductor is properly tuned to the rate at which the electrons are orbiting the atoms of the iron magnet. In speculation it seems this should create a very high frequency AC current in the inductor if it is properly tuned to the rate of orbit of the electrons in the iron.

I can picture it all in my head, but where I'm struggling with figuring this out is my lack of knowledge when it comes to electrical power itself and things like inductance and how to build a coil that's supposed to resonate at a specific frequency.


What I picture is a coil wrapped around an iron magnetized core that is in tune with the frequency at which the literal electrons are orbiting the iron atoms.

AlteredUnity posted this 19 June 2024

Interesting concept, the easiest way to produce a signal in that frequency range would be a frequency multiplier maybe? Though even with this it is highly doubtful you would be able to operate in this range with an inductor, the parasitic effects of components alone would be hard to overcome. For a wire to operate at this frequency with skin effect would have to be tiny, and the length would have to be in the range of micro meters. Making and tuning a coil at this frequency for power doesnt seem practical. I may be wrong....

Vidura posted this 19 June 2024

Acording to the actual findings of quantum pysics it is highly doubtful that electrons and other particles exist at all. For the practical implementations it would not likely be possible to work with the  above mentioned frequencies. Anyway I would recommend some research on Floyd Sweet's SQM. According to his findings the resonant frequency(inherent from manifacturing process) of his 1"x 4" x 6" ferrite magnets was typically in the range around 20Hz, which could be made visible with the silicone steel sheets attached to the top of the magnet.

Vidura

YoElMiCrO posted this 19 June 2024

Hello everyone.

As you say, that would happen if we were able to realize
an LC circuit at that frequency, but...
For reasons of technology it is impossible to achieve it at present and
I doubt that in the near future, as AlteredUnity says, the elements
parasites will work against you.
On the other hand, it would be another thing to take his average, as Floyd Sweet did
in their SQM/VTA with their magnets, as Vidura comments.

YoElMiCrO.

Vasile posted this 19 June 2024

Quoting:Apoc

a coil that's supposed to resonate at a specific frequency.

Most probably this is how microentities (cells, etc.) receive and transmit energy, but to do it artificially at that small of a scale seems kind of difficult.

Apoc posted this 19 June 2024

I did some more talking with Chat GPT today, from what I understand those VERY high freuqencies are actually a result of 1 Tesla + Magnetic fields that it gave me those freuqnecies, and at lower "B" levels the frequencies actually become much smaller making this way more feasable unless I'm misunderstanding Chat GPT or asking the wrong questions. According to chat GPT you can increase resonant frequencies in an LC circuit if multiple coils are used and wired in Paralell aswell. Otherwise the dimensions of the coils Chat GPT spits out for such high freuqnecies are almost physically impossible to create.

 

I'm currently at my Chat GPT 4 limit for the day though. That and I by no means understand the math chat GPT is spitting out to me, I work more on the creative side of this stuff so I've just been bouncing ideas off of chat gpts calculations.

 

Another thing to note, what lead me down this rabbit hole is, I think I accidentally once wound a coil around a magnet that just by random chance resonated with the magnetic fields microscopic fluctuations due to electron motion and my multimeter was reading a steady milli amp output which I couldn't figure out where it was coming from. Unfortunately I messed with it (was trying to do something else and took it apart lol) and couldn't repeat the experiment but I think its because the coil needs to be very specific (turns length dimensions etc) to resonate with the magnetic field.

Fighter posted this 20 June 2024

Quoting:Apoc

Another thing to note, what lead me down this rabbit hole is, I think I accidentally once wound a coil around a magnet that just by random chance resonated with the magnetic fields microscopic fluctuations due to electron motion and my multimeter was reading a steady milli amp output which I couldn't figure out where it was coming from. Unfortunately I messed with it (was trying to do something else and took it apart lol) and couldn't repeat the experiment but I think its because the coil needs to be very specific (turns length dimensions etc) to resonate with the magnetic field.

That sounds extremely interesting, I never heard of this kind of phenomenon. A coil with specific characteristics (turns, length, dimensions) to resonate with a permanent magnet's field ? In my mind it kind of makes sense...

That would be the first time a mechanism for harnessing energy directly from the field of a permanent magnet would be demonstrated.

Don't give up, try to build again that specific coil !

That would be awesome.

Regards,

Fighter 

"If you want to find the secrets of the universe, think in terms of energy, frequency and vibration."
Nikola Tesla
Apoc posted this 20 June 2024

I'm trying, I don't have the math skills to compute the number of turns required so I've been using Chat GPT to run numbers for me. It seems like since they released Chat GPT 4 which you only get a certain amount of information you can process unless you pay 20 dollars a month for it. So it "Reverts" back to chat gpt 3.5, which ironically enough it gives you formulas but doesn't solve them for you like 4 will even though 3.5 used to solve the same stuff. Everythings a money scheme these days, granted I'm still grateful we even have that program cause its doing like advanced calculus for me which I can't even understand.

Fighter posted this 21 June 2024

I'm also using ChatGPT from time to time, like I did here, it's useful.

The only problem with it it's the fact that they limited it so it would avoid answers about "exotic" technologies like zero-point energy and devices which are using principles beyond the borders of the "official" physics.

There ChatGPT become evasive and it's just providing useless answers like:

Scientific Consensus: The scientific community is generally skeptical about the feasibility of extracting usable energy from zero-point energy. Most researchers consider it a theoretical curiosity rather than a practical energy source.

Free Energy Devices: Zero-point energy is sometimes cited in pseudoscientific claims about free energy devices. These claims are not supported by empirical evidence and are widely regarded as fraudulent or based on misunderstandings of physics.

When I see those answers I smile because I know it's just refusing to go over its imposed limits.

That's where ChatGPT becomes useless.

But except those limitations it's a useful tool.

"If you want to find the secrets of the universe, think in terms of energy, frequency and vibration."
Nikola Tesla
Jagau posted this 5 weeks ago

Chatgpt is a very concise summary of everything that is written on the web, it provides a written summary. It does not experiment and does not make discoveries, with its algorithms it learns what you place on the web, in other words if you do not teach it anything, it does not learn.

If you experiment yourself in your workshop, you will learn and perhaps teach Chatgpt when you say it on the web.

But for sure it can be useful like any good search site but you have to be careful it selects what it thinks is best, it's not always correct.

I prefer standard web search sites, I can better select what seems more appropriate to me according to my knowledge and type of experiments to be done, chatgpt cannot tell the difference he writes very concisely what is most popular.

Jagau

Apoc posted this 5 weeks ago

Well one thing Chat GPT is good at for me is doing complex mathematical calculations that I'd need like a degree in advanced calculus to understand.

Specifically I found it rather very useful recently for giving the approximate design to have an LC circuit resonate at a specified frequency and calculate the dimensions of the inductor for me. Granted you'd still need to build it and then adjust it using a signal generator and an o-scope but for ideas and concepts it works nicely.

 

So anyway, I've hit a wall with this idea, the problem is that Chat GPT says electrons don't "orbit atoms at a specific speed or frequency the way one imagines orbiting in celestial bodies. The electrons kind of just exist in a cloud around the nucleus and the frequency of them at which they move around is in the THz range which is almost impossible to build a resonate LC circuit for from what I've found so far.

There was one thing I'm still looking into called the "Larmor" Frequency its sort of the gyroscopic precesion of the electrons, and this happens at much lower frequencies.

Chat GPT was also quick to point out that these microscopic changes in the magnetic field kind of become a cloud at the macroscopic level of the over all magnetic field and any such frequency is esentially drowned out or null hence why they say the field is "Static".

 

I'm still trying to figure out why my coil was generating a solid 100 or so miliamps DC when it was connected. It was just a coil wrapped and counter wrapped over some Neodymium magnet cylinders with a Piezoelectric transducer sandwiched to the magnets (not connected to the coil through wires but connected to itself [I wired up my experiment wrong]).

Then me and my damn tunnel vision of what I was doing originally took it apart without recording the dimensions or schematic of what I made and haven't been able to replicate it since.

It was a solid miliamp DC current without any other ways to generate it. I'm starting to think now that the Transducer I had attached to the magnet was somehow oscilating due to the magnetic field giving way to induction into the coil with a small amperage generated.

 

Sorry for the wall of text. I just really want to figure out how to replicate this again and discover the mechanic behind it, been wracking my brain for months cussin at myself for taking it apart so quickly without properly documenting it.

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